I had heard through the grapevine that someone was having difficulty accessing the Forum so I had to figure out why.  Well, they were trying to access this new Forum, which now requires that you be a WEF member.  Anyway, we'll see how this Forum works out.  Let's see how this posts.

Victor

Okay, so I got on w/o having to put in any member data.

This is a test to see if the message actually posts.

Chuck Lytle, 12/2/09 6:07 AM, PST

Just testing out the forum

Terry

I logged in and posting to see how it appears on the forum.

Egadz

Just testing.  Not a member.

Old Lag

I tried accessing the old Forum around 0930 hrs today 3 Dec 09.  I get a page telling me that there is a broken link.  Has anyone else had trouble accessing the old Forum?  Has the plug been pulled?

Victor

www.santacruzproductions.com

SantaCruz Productions Blog

That last post was me.  Old Lag.

Hello All,

The link to the old forum is definitely "broken."  I tried a number of times between 5:15 and 5:30 AM PST.  No go.

To get here, I went to WEF.org and followed the links.  I didn't see an option to log in as a member.  There's a checkmark up in the left corner next to "post anonymous," but it doesn't seem to function.  It appears as if the WEF main site recognizes me via my work email address, but this new forum page doesn't.

So much for high tech.

Chuck Lytle

Okay, all I want to do is see how this posts.  This time, I actually logged in at the main WEF page.  Had to find my membership card and remember my password.  (If the world only knew how I suffer sometimes....)

Boy, am I gonna be mad if I lose my SUPREME BEING chops!  I've babbled on for YEARS to earn that.

Chuck Lytle

Oh, I do notice that the text box won't do a hard return within the screen.  Text continues on past what's viewable.  (Is that a word??)

Added later:  I also note the crazy "joined" date on my posting.  A random number generator??  I think that's the day I forgot to put out the garbage.  WEF spies are everywhere.

I'm pretty sure the old forum is gone.  I've tried several times to access it and it always times out with the 'broken link' message.  I'm not a WEF member and don't see any benefits to joining currently so I don't plan to shell out the cash.  It doesn't look like anyone is posting anything now.  I hope this thing doesn't go away.  I sure have enjoyed everyone's companionship.

David

Every year my company teaches a class of WW operators basic lab techniques.  We volunteer for this (OK, we are not total altruists because we hope that some of them might remember us and use us sometimes) and it costs us quite a bit -- last year I probably used 100 hours to make slides, do the presentations etc.  I am proud of the fact that we got around 30 WW operators through their Class I and II WW Lab Analyst tests last year.

I am going to have to change one of my most important slides: Information Sources. I refer them to the old BBS where there is a wealth of information from people who have been there and done that. Now that is destroyed.  I think that's sad and I expected better from WEF.   Especially after they asked us for feedback, got it, and 100% ignored it.

See you guys -- it's been fun.  I shall probably continue to come here occasionally to see if anyone is around, but I think it's going to be like returning to a bar where you used to have a good time in the old days but now it's empty.

Old Lag.

I am glad to be part of this forum. This is regarding CBOD analyses. Our lab generally has trouble with the unseeded water blank depleting too much.

0.2 mg/L or less is the requirement. Many times re-cleaning all the glassware in a highly alkaline cleaner will fi the problem, but not always.

Does anyone else have a similar problem/ And how are you addressing it?

To the anonymous person asking about CBOD blanks.  Are you adding the pyridine inhibitor to the blank?  If so, discontinue doing that...pyridine is an organic compound and it has an oxygen demand.

General comment to anybody using this new WEF forum format...it would help to add some kind of identifier to your posts so all non-WEF members can be called something other than "Anonymous". 

Perry

Sorry to see they murdered the forum. It was struggling before and a weekly (or even monthly) visit was enough to keep up with all the posts. I may check in a few times in the next few months to see if I was wrong. So much for WEF's outreach efforts to operators & labtechs.

Brent

Hello to WEF's most active forum users,

I’d like to thank you all for your invaluable contributions to the discussion forums.  It is your input that makes these forums such a useful tool to both members and nonmembers.  Thank you also for your patience and feedback during the transition from WEF's old forums to the new forums.  I understand that there are some growing pains associated with implementing a new software, and I ask for your continued patience while WEF works to make these new forums as useful as possible. 

First off, I want to acknowledge an error we are working on - currently, only WEF members can login to the new forum software.  Anyone who is not a member must post anonymously.  This is not our intention and is simply an unexpected bug that we encountered.  We are working quickly to resolve it.  It is vital to WEF that all nonmembers can continue contributing their knowledge to the forums with ease. 

Secondly, I want to address the loss of the archived forum content.  We regret not being able to keep the old content, but it simply was not financially feasible.  Please keep in mind that the forums are a completely free tool, and WEF makes no profit from them. 

Again, thank you for your feedback during this transition and please continue to post to the forums while we improve them.  We believe that in time, and with your continued help, these forums will build up a wealth of useful content.

Thanks,

Julie Fuller

Forum Admin

I can almost accept the proposal that it was unintended for non-WEF members to be able to log in and post.  I say almost because from the very beginning of this version of the forum being active the directions at the top of the page have stated that "you will need to log in with your WEF member ID to post new topics or responses."  If they knew about this alledged bug before going live with the new version, why not just wait however long to fix that before putting them up?

Was there no way to export the forum posts to a text file?  We wouldn't have needed any of the smilies or forum avatars to be saved, just the actual words.  You could have even not bothered saving the Christmas Carols posting or other such non-important posts to cut down on actual space required.  I would have even volunteered some of my time to do this manually if needed.

Sorry for the grumpiness and cynicism.  Having my identity back will go a long way to soothing my feelings.

I now seem to be able to post again, although anonymously.  I was not able to post this morning.

I second the comments from an earlier poster: it's weird to call this a bug if it says in bold, at the top of the page, that this is the intention.

"WEF makes no profit  . . . "  - that makes my blood boil.  The profit we ALL make is that waterways are cleaner because of the efforts of people on this board, and because of the efforts of WPCF/WEF over the years.  For that WEF deserves our gratitude, and gets mine.  But might I remind WEF that those of us who occasionally help someone with an answer to an issue make no profit, make no demands for payment, and contribute their time freely.  You have unpaid people driving traffic to the WEF site:  that has to be worth something.

And BTW: I choose to post anonymously because I work for a fairly well known company in this field.  I am not here to advertise my company's services, and nor is it fair for them to perhaps take the blame if I say something dumb.

Finally: what would be the cost of maintaining those old threads?  Did you consider looking for sponsorship?  Storage is pretty cheap these days.

Old Lag

Victor, just out of curiosity, was there a similar level of outrage to the 2005 update?

Shane

It's difficult to defend the entity that just chopped the head off of one of your favorite toys, but I must say this in defense of WEF.  Even non-profit organizations need income to keep themselves afloat, and I personally think that if WEF wants to accept paid advertising on the technical discussion forums, good for them...it's one way of keeping membership fees and the price of, for example, Standard Methods, as low as possible.  Also, in my opinion, they can, and should, encourage membership.  But to allow only members to post on the technical forums is a grossly misdirected idea on how to increase membership rolls...if anything, it might do just the opposite.  I dropped my membership when I became unemployed (through retirement) a few years back, but if I hadn't already done so, this latest change, which degrades usability and discourages forum activity (ironic, isn't it, when you look at the goals at the top of the page!), would probably have been enough to tip me over the edge.

Perry

There are several points that I will address:

1. Shane: Prior to 2005, Forum participation was scant, limited, so the change was not perceived as great as it has been these past few weeks.  As you notice from the postings, the majority of dissatisfied "customers" have been from laboratory participants which, if anyone had cared to noticed, comprised a large percentage of the postings in the previous life of this Forum.
2. It is only a matter of time before it becomes a financial burder to WEF to maintain,upkeep, monitor this Forum so the excuse that it was becoming such a monster just does not fit the bill.  Storage, memory is cheap!  I am not privy to the discussions that arose and who the bright minds were that offered the idea that a "new, easy to use, sponsored Forum" would be best for everyone, except the participants.
3. WEF did use postings from the Forums on its "Laboratory Solutions" printing.  At first, e-mails were sent by WEF to Forum participants asking for their permission to print their comments.  I guess either many people did not respond or were denying WEF permission.  WEF's solution: don't include participant's names in the printing.  Anyone could easily go online and find out who it was, if it wasn't someone with a "handle".  Was this a directed effort by WEF to drive up its subscriber base to Laboratory Solutions or just plain add something of substance to the periodical?
4. Need to find out if WEF truly understands Social Media, its implications, its "powers" to drive traffic way up as well as participation from not only its members but bring in others not affiliated with this industry.  There were several posting that I saw from nonmembers not only asking questions but participating/collaborating to the best of their knowledge.  This industry is multidisciplinary and you truly have to acknowledge this.  Engineers alone will not solve the problems, even if they have a few hours of training on how to use a microscope or a have a glimpse of introductory chemistry.
5. Lastly, it truly was/is a huge loss of an extensive database of knowledge.  Unless, WEF is planning to sell it pretty soon as MOP-13.  Conspiracy theory, yeah!

people

agreed.

i've been trying for days to get here; so now what?

i'm pained by the loss of all those wonderful, educational discussions that i learned much from...

o well the price of any upgrade must be born by the natives

we'll see if this small quote can get in

love&peace, steve a.

Has the Web master read this? jfuller is listed at the top of the page, so how about sending the emails that way. Me, if want to gripe about stuff, I have more fun with NELAC.

Sounds like most of the old crew is here, so now we just need some questions.

Mark

Let 'er Flush

OK I have now registered per the new instructions and plan to use my old handle.

I am not confident it will work because the box I am typing in says I am posting anonymously.

Old Lag

I think that sticking with the WEF forum will be more likely to result in lively technical discussions as we had in the past.  The Water and Wastewater forum doesn't seem to be catching on very quickly.

But to make this WEF forum work, SOMEBODY must start posting some original questions/requests pertaining to lab work.  To do that, non-members must first register (if you haven't already registered...a simple operation...and then log in each time you want to start a "new topic."  I came across a new BOD issue when assessing a WWTP lab last week, so I'll post a request for thoughts on the issue and see what happens.

Perry Brake

Still "anonymous" even though I have registered...